Would like to point out....

That.

Although a lot of people would like a single deck bus to drive, I am glad that this game is around double deck buses. Coming from a country where double deck buses are the norm, including Hong Kong where the super double deckers up to 12m in length rule the streets. Single deck buses aren't my cup of tea, they're for elderly people and children, as thats what they're mostly used for here in London / UK.

I had no idea West Berlin used double deckers so this is just perfect. Im sure people in some parts of America / Central & Eastern Europe must feel ecstatic about handling a real bus which has two levels!!!

JunGRail schrieb:

That.

Although a lot of people would like a single deck bus to drive, I am glad that this game is around double deck buses. Coming from a country where double deck buses are the norm, including Hong Kong where the super double deckers up to 12m in length rule the streets. Single deck buses aren't my cup of tea, they're for elderly people and children, as thats what they're mostly used for here in London / UK.

I had no idea West Berlin used double deckers so this is just perfect. Im sure people in some parts of America / Central & Eastern Europe must feel ecstatic about handling a real bus which has two levels!!!

OMSI has been a great game to make me learn more about these buses.
Here in Brazil they're very uncommon unfortunately. The majority of DDs here is composed by coaches.
I'm willing to study in Europe this year and if everything goes well, I'm looking forward to visit UK at the end of the year to see these double deckers that until today I've only seen in games and movies lol (and also to learn more about the countries, their culture etc.)

Most of DD buses around here appear in tourism lines like this one, which has a Mercedes O500 engine 6 gears ZF:

JunGRail schrieb:

Single deck buses aren't my cup of tea, they're for elderly people and children, as thats what they're mostly used for here in London / UK.

Wrong. Double ones are for bigger cities with the need of a transport big enough for all the people. Where I live we always had single decks (I think that 40-50 years ago they tried a double decker one but didn't success). And even in some lines with lower passenger rate, specially areas whith lots of curves and small roads (where a normal bus wouldn't fit) we use smaller buses. Well, for some lines we use this longer buses, don't know how they are called in english... they carry another "module" behind, because they use to carry a lot of people.

I always thought that double decker buses were only in London (I remember as a kid watching those red buses on pictures).

With this game I learned about doubles in Berlin.

So no, single ones aren't for elders or children. Each city has the buses it needs. It's true that here at rush hours buses use to get full with people standing (so a double one would make sense), but the rest of the day, the bus is at half seat use.

This is right now the different bus brands used in my area:
http://www.dbus.es/es/empresa/flota

(You can see that there are some bus+trailer models, some normal, and then the smaller one I talked about)


P.S. Oh, now that I see Thiago's post, I just remember we have a double decker . It's the "tourist bus", yeah. It's some kind of "classic" older model, used only for the typical tourist tour around the city.

Oh my.... just looking for our tourist bus to show a picture here, I found a link on a forum, saying that it's an "ex-Berlin bus, converted to tourist bus":

http://subefotos.com/ver/?3c62670e4448ebea171185f9298e755ao.jpg


Tell me it's not an SD 200, or I'm gonna cry like a girl at a Take That concert (and maybe even ride it!)

Of course that's an ex-Berlin SD200 It's BVG 3249 (SD83).

In Australia, the large number of double decker buses that were once in revenue service in Sydney have been replaced with standard rigid and articulated buses. The experience here is that single deck articulated buses are more suitable for routes with frequent stops and large numbers of people contantly boarding and alighting and double decker buses are more suitable for limited stop and 'express' services. In Perth (my home city), articulated buses make up nearly 10% of the bus fleet, with the remainder being standard rigid buses of lengths between 11m and 12.3m.

Irreo schrieb:

JunGRail schrieb:

Single deck buses aren't my cup of tea, they're for elderly people and children, as thats what they're mostly used for here in London / UK.

Wrong. Double ones are for bigger cities with the need of a transport big enough for all the people. Where I live we always had single decks (I think that 40-50 years ago they tried a double decker one but didn't success). And even in some lines with lower passenger rate, specially areas whith lots of curves and small roads (where a normal bus wouldn't fit) we use smaller buses. Well, for some lines we use this longer buses, don't know how they are called in english... they carry another "module" behind, because they use to carry a lot of people.

I always thought that double decker buses were only in London (I remember as a kid watching those red buses on pictures).

With this game I learned about doubles in Berlin.

So no, single ones aren't for elders or children. Each city has the buses it needs. It's true that here at rush hours buses use to get full with people standing (so a double one would make sense), but the rest of the day, the bus is at half seat use.

This is right now the different bus brands used in my area:
http://www.dbus.es/es/empresa/flota

(You can see that there are some bus+trailer models, some normal, and then the smaller one I talked about)


P.S. Oh, now that I see Thiago's post, I just remember we have a double decker . It's the "tourist bus", yeah. It's some kind of "classic" older model, used only for the typical tourist tour around the city.

I've got to counteract your comment there, i know because we use both types, each city has its size buses depending on the service needed. In London the double deckers have lengthened slightly but not greatly compared to the old MCW / Leyland models we used to run. I know this because i speak regularly with people who work in the transport sector. They are for children and elders because 1) they serve the non-principal roads i.e. not the main roads (so the residential roads) the original idea was to have those as shuttle buses for the main routes, and to ferry children and elders to and from school and make it easier for people who aren't able to drive, the bus serves the roads where only cars or mini buses are permitted, we call them hail and ride. They do now use them on main routes, depends on time of day, early morning double decker, single decker remainder of the day.

poweredbycng schrieb:

In Australia, the large number of double decker buses that were once in revenue service in Sydney have been replaced with standard rigid and articulated buses. The experience here is that single deck articulated buses are more suitable for routes with frequent stops and large numbers of people contantly boarding and alighting and double decker buses are more suitable for limited stop and 'express' services. In Perth (my home city), articulated buses make up nearly 10% of the bus fleet, with the remainder being standard rigid buses of lengths between 11m and 12.3m.

We tried that here and as you may now it didn't work out. Those buses suit airports where the road system is either one way or big enough for those buses to maneuver. Basically saying this game is by far showing people without knowledge of double deckers how much fun they are, they lean when going round corners, when coming down the stairs during motion its a firm grip on the rails to help you walk down the stairs. At night although not many people use the bus, they still use double deckers.

In London they use newer models at night, better acceleration to keep up with the tighter timetable. Hence why i like to use the D92 on the 13N

JunGRail schrieb:

I've got to counteract your comment there, i know because we use both types, each city has its size buses depending on the service needed. In London the double deckers have lengthened slightly but not greatly compared to the old MCW / Leyland models we used to run. I know this because i speak regularly with people who work in the transport sector. They are for children and elders because 1) they serve the non-principal roads i.e. not the main roads (so the residential roads) the original idea was to have those as shuttle buses for the main routes, and to ferry children and elders to and from school and make it easier for people who aren't able to drive, the bus serves the roads where only cars or mini buses are permitted, we call them hail and ride. They do now use them on main routes, depends on time of day, early morning double decker, single decker remainder of the day.

Hmmm... I'm not sure but I think we are saying the same things, but I'm confused because I don't know if you're talking about a general rule, or just talking about how it works on Berlin or your city. Of course that each city selects the bus size depending on the service needed. That's what I said (and the "size" word works both for lenght and number of floors).

What I meant is that a single decker isn't specifically BUILT for elders and children. A different thing is that a city decides to USE them for that purpose, while using double deckers for the rest of services. I've been in France, Italy and Argentina, and all buses I've seen are single deckers.

Rüdiger Hülsmann schrieb:

Of course that's an ex-Berlin SD200 It's BVG 3249 (SD83).

Thanks!

But how do you know it's the 3249, or SD83?. You either know that specific information, or saw the number somewhere and I missed it, or either you're a bus-pedia

Now don't tell me you also remember you used that bus

I just googled the number plate, here's what I found:

http://www.berliner-verkehr.de/bfad.htm

Firstly, I don't think there's any relevence to a "double vs single deck" debate - I'm sure the vast majority of OMSI fans will in time, want a variation of both double, single, large and small buses (personally I'd love a minibus type for the really short routes like Grundorf and Dortmund).

Saying "single deckers are for children and the elderly" is a bit provocative in my opinion and is not true in fact. (Does that mean that in cities that only use single decker buses, buses are only used by children and the elderley!!?!"

It's simply to do with capacity and economics. Smaller single deck buses are lighter and more fuel-efficient. They carry less revenue passengers but the lower operating costs can balance against that and make them a more suitable choice. How many cities have low-level bridges? Here is the UK we have an awful, antiquated rail network but in countries like Spain, Germany and France that have more modern rail networks, and thus more low level bridges, it doesn't make sense for the bus operator to invest in DDs if half their routes span under a bridge.

Modern DDs have 'floor-level' systems just the same as modern single-deckers, so the elderley, disabled and people with pushchairs can access them just as well as single deckers.

....it's just capacity and economy.

Well... we have the 91 SD202 here,only for sightseeing .

MAN SD 202 Sightseeing

New headlights on this one

EDIT- There is also this version ...

Man citadino headlights

Rüdiger Hülsmann schrieb:

I just googled the number plate, here's what I found:

http://www.berliner-verkehr.de/bfad.htm

Thanks man, I didn't even though on the plate. I tried googling for something like "san sebastian buys berlin bus", and similar searches, with no result... Looking at that page, it seems that Berlin didn't only take profit selling tickets to passenger, but also reselling all the old-used buses

davidrogers schrieb:

Firstly, I don't think there's any relevence to a "double vs single deck" debate (...)

It's simply to do with capacity and economics. Smaller single deck buses are lighter and more fuel-efficient. They carry less revenue passengers but the lower operating costs can balance against that and make them a more suitable choice. How many cities have low-level bridges? Here is the UK we have an awful, antiquated rail network but in countries like Spain, Germany and France that have more modern rail networks, and thus more low level bridges, it doesn't make sense for the bus operator to invest in DDs if half their routes span under a bridge.

Modern DDs have 'floor-level' systems just the same as modern single-deckers, so the elderley, disabled and people with pushchairs can access them just as well as single deckers.

....it's just capacity and economy.

You said it all there man, and that's what I was talking about. I didn't even though about the bridges when I wrote my previous post, but let me tell you that here there are some line and/or routes where the buse goes under a bridge where a DD probably wouldn't fit.

Now talking about the floor height, I remember in older buses where you had to step up stairs, and also go stairs down. It took a while for older people to get out of the bus.

This is one of the first buses I remember from when I was a little kid. Those "accordion" doors bring me good memories (Pegaso 6035):
https://2img.net/r/ihimizer/i/Pegaso6035AdeBurgos4.jpg/sr=1

The next one I remember is this one (Pegaso 6038). It was used for some time along with the Pegaso 6035. I still remember the driver switching gears:
https://2img.net/r/ihimizer/img67/157/emt1007pegaso6038fn3.jpg

Personally I find that there is little difference to driving a double decker bus vs. driving a single deck bus of the same length.

You're driving a bus, so you're cornering at reasonable speeds anyway. I'm a quick driver and have little trouble keeping to a timetable but even then you have to respect the fact that you're driving a bus and it display a certain amount of top-heaviness no matter which make or model.

Personally, I believe that for quieter services, a 12m rigid single deck bus is the best choice. In fact, the 12m single deck bus is ideal for the vast majority of services, busy or not. I believe that high-capacity buses should only be used in instances where an increase in frequency of the service is impractical (i.e. the frequency is already very high) or on services where sudden heavy loads are experienced on a regular basis.

JunGRail schrieb:

That.

Although a lot of people would like a single deck bus to drive, I am glad that this game is around double deck buses. Coming from a country where double deck buses are the norm, including Hong Kong where the super double deckers up to 12m in length rule the streets. Single deck buses aren't my cup of tea, they're for elderly people and children, as thats what they're mostly used for here in London / UK.

I had no idea West Berlin used double deckers so this is just perfect. Im sure people in some parts of America / Central & Eastern Europe must feel ecstatic about handling a real bus which has two levels!!!

At least you guys get real buses for your senior shuttles, we get these pieces of garbage...

Zitat :

Coming from a country where double deck buses are the norm,

Not here, in my county we have a grand total of... wait for it... FIVE!

Zitat :

In fact, the 12m single deck bus is ideal for the vast majority of services, busy or not.

Again, not here! Too big. Single deck midibuses rule the roost here. Very few of our routes are suitable for a full sized bus like that, meaning they're not very versatile and therefore we have very little of them. The few we do have, they're still not ideal and are always getting into sticky situations, mounting curbs, swiping things etc. (example: https://i.imgur.com/iOput.jpg)

Unfortunately, this means we have an abundance of the ubiquity that is the Dennis/Transbus/ADL Dart!

There is a double deck bus in Sydney for tourist purposes but no idea what it actually is to be honest.

JayKae schrieb:

There is a double deck bus in Sydney for tourist purposes but no idea what it actually is to be honest.

Alexander Dennis Enviro 500 I would imagine, a few have gone over there.

BusRider schrieb:

JunGRail schrieb:

That.

Although a lot of people would like a single deck bus to drive, I am glad that this game is around double deck buses. Coming from a country where double deck buses are the norm, including Hong Kong where the super double deckers up to 12m in length rule the streets. Single deck buses aren't my cup of tea, they're for elderly people and children, as thats what they're mostly used for here in London / UK.

I had no idea West Berlin used double deckers so this is just perfect. Im sure people in some parts of America / Central & Eastern Europe must feel ecstatic about handling a real bus which has two levels!!!

At least you guys get real buses for your senior shuttles, we get these pieces of garbage...

I agree with whoever said buses are chosen depending on each places need and I would like to add, operator preference e.g. Lothian Buses has always had more double deckers than single deckers, while it would appear that Stagecoach Fife has more singles. It depends on cost sometimes too, the single decker would work out cheaper as it is light than the double decker so smaller operators/those that carry few passengers would choose it.

As for the senior shuttles we have "pieces of garbage" too:


Although I like all (or most) buses, I do prefer "proper" buses (i.e. bigger than an Mercedes 709D) than minibuses. Hmm.. wouldnt mind a 709D or Vario for OMSI though (an Allison Vario and fully manual 709D).

Yeah that is a load of crap about them only being for elderly and children... we use single decks for everything. Except for the university service which uses purple Wright StreetCar articulated buses but that's because they local authority will not allow double deck buses on school and university services. It's quite simply a matter of CAPACITY and nothing more. Articulated buses and double deck buses will never regularly be used on routes that don't need them. What you have learned from people in the "industry" is either complete nonsense and they're misinformed or it only applies to a particular area which has different rules and policies than most other places.

ediblechickenwing schrieb:

Yeah that is a load of crap about them only being for elderly and children... we use single decks for everything. Except for the university service which uses purple Wright StreetCar articulated buses but that's because they local authority will not allow double deck buses on school and university services. It's quite simply a matter of CAPACITY and nothing more. Articulated buses and double deck buses will never regularly be used on routes that don't need them. What you have learned from people in the "industry" is either complete nonsense and they're misinformed or it only applies to a particular area which has different rules and policies than most other places.

Gosh this is an old post lol,

Yes i was wrong to state that, what i meant its on the Dial-A-Ride routes we have in London, to help serve the non-principal roads to connect to the major bus stations for mainline bus routes. Preference for Double Deckers in London is just what was ordained. Unfortunately we don't have the Enviro 500, too big for london roads, the Enviro 400 is the version we have, numerous of those are being run and since Stagecoach is now back controlling the East London fleet, the Enviro 400 is the norm, since Stagecoach prefer Alexander Dennis.

I digress, no-one has attempted to do a simulation based on double deckers, i was hoping the chinese would do a simulator since Hong Kong runs some fantastically large vehicles, super olympians and enviro 500s. Alot of models they get London can't get.

Would love a simulation of Berlin's Lion City, still on my wish list, i need to learn Blender me thinks!